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Alis Dee Patron

Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:56 am Post subject: The FURCer's Guide to Do Rite More Guderer |
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The FURCer's Guide to Do Rite More Guderer
or, How to RP Like You Mean It
I admit it; I'm a consummate RP eavesdropper. There's nothing I like more than to kick back, sit myself in a public place, put on a movie and eavesdrop on other people's RP. At least, in theory. Too often I find my voyeuristic enjoyment of someone else's drama ruined by shitty fucking writing. You've all seen it -- some of you probably do it -- so you all know what I'm talking about; whether it's pronoun avoidance, obtuse purple prose, bad tenses or incomprehensible run-on sentences.
I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt and assume that the vast majority of the bad writing I see around the place is the result of people simply not knowing any better. So, as part of my ongoing and mostly futile effort to spread better writing practices around furc's RP community, I present to you a short guide.
Because they're a handy-dandy teaching aid, I've tried to illustrate each of my points with live examples of bad writing pulled right out of my own furc logs. All names have been changed to protect the guileless, of course, and if you recognise someone, keep it to yourselves (unless it's you). And before someone asks; what gives me the right to re-write other people's words? Editorial comment. I'm no Hemingway or nufin' but -- false modesty aside -- I know I'm a damn sight better writer than most people that will be reading this...
Let's begin, shall we?
Rule #1: Purple Prose != Erudite Writing
Let me introduce you to a little friend of mine. His name is purple prose and he's a literary criticism used to describe writing that is overly extravagant to the point of distraction. If the style of your writing -- generally over-use of adjectives, archaic words and melodramatic pathos -- makes it difficult for a reader to make sense of the substance of what you're trying to say, you're guilty of purple prose. In furc, this kind of writing most frequently manifests itself as over-use of ridiculous pseudo-archaic words (auds and occulars are everyone's favourite examples, but things like 'pon, 'neath and tresses also count) and an overly formal writing style. I most often see it in descs. It comes about, I think, when people who -- let's face it -- aren't very skilled at writing attempt to sound Ye Olde Worlde; like Tolkeinesque high fantasy medieval noblemen. I'm going to state this simply; it doesn't work. In fact, very few professional fantasy authors manage to pull off this style of writing.
So how do we avoid it? Well, for starters, stop using all those fucking dumbass words. If you need to make a choice between tresses and hair, for godssakes say 'hair'. Nine times out of ten black is a perfect substitute for the word 'black'. Things are on and under. This is one of those walk-before-you-run things; we all love creative writing and whatever, but you need to learn to write in a way that is simple and readable before you can start throwing around inventive adjectives and wordings.
Believe it or not, I actually had a hard time finding a suitable example of purple prose in my logs; which might go to show that this sort of writing is less common than the number of people who rant against it might suggest. Either that, or I just can't find an example in between six straight days' worth of chat in *ooc (logging off is for noobs k). Anyway, after much scouring I eventually came across:
| Quote: | | Laucian would blink and turn his gaze to the Jötun. "Hnn? Get wot fixed?" He asked. Hell had it been so long since he'd seen Loki? Indeed it had been. Indeed. Since before the disownment. He was still sour about that. He took another deep chug of his drink and settle it down. He'd rub his hand over short messy locks of Ebony and Azul. Ears plainly seen carring bars and studs and such. Left eye was the scarring one, which was dulilng some with the Wine/Blood mix. He'd sigh and tilt his head some, Arctic hues clouding. |
Ouch. Just... ouch. I like this example, mostly because it's largely free of the kind of pacing and voice issues I'm planning on talking about below, so we can focus instead on the language used. If a reasonably intelligent and educated reader (such as your truly) needs to look up a word that you have used, and that word has a less archaic equivalent, you are guilty of bad writing. This passage contains a few obvious examples; disownment, locks, ebony (a noun semi-incorrectly used here as an adjective; the proper word is 'ebon'), azul (a Spanish word whose English equivalent is 'azure'; a particular shade of bright sky blue), dulilng (possibly supposed to be 'dilating' from the context; expanding or contracting pupils), Arctic hues (either white or blue, or blue-white; take your pick). There are also some less obvious examples; phrases made from common words that, when strung together, just don't read right or make sense. To me, this passage reads as if the author isn't particular confident in their writing abilities or vocabulary, and is using difficult, florid prose to overcompensate. Let's try a re-write:
| Quote: | | Laucian blinked and turned his gaze to Loki. "Hnn? Get wot fixed?" he asked. Hell, had it really been so long since he'd seen the jötun? It certainly seemed like it; by his reckoning they hadn't crossed paths since before the Disownment. He was still sour about that. He took another deep swig of his drink before settling the tankard down on the bar with a hollow thud, running a hand through messy black and blue hair as he did so. The studs and bars in his ears glinted coldly in the candlelight as he sighed, tilting his head back a little, cold eyes hazing over slightly as the bloodwine started to take effect. |
Phew, there's quite a lot going on here. So, what did we change? Firstly, I got rid of the excruciatingly awkward past perfect tense (something which I think might get its own section since it's so common and so hideous) and re-set it as simple past. Secondly, I switched around the two references to the other character (here played by Loki); in the original they were descriptive first, name second. In this, they are name first and descriptive second; I thought it worked better to establish who were were talking about first, though note this is out of the original context (ie. as part of a conversation). I'm not sure what I feel about this 'disownment' thing; it's an odd word but if it's referring to some unknown past event which is called The Disownment it's quite clever, but if it's just thesaurus humping for something else it's unnecessary. I've kept it in and given it a capital, giving the benifit of my doubt to the original author. I like the He was still sour about that line a lot, so that stayed, but I couldn't quite get myself to keep in the 'indeed indeed' bit, which seemed overwritten. 'Chug' got replaced with 'swig' because I think it sounds smoother, and I tried to get rid of the ambiguity (and bad tense) of settle it down. Ebon-azul locks have gone back to being black and blue hair (thank gods). I'm assuming carring bars is a typo ('carrying bars'), and tried to re-word this sentence to be a bit more poetic ('ears plainly seen' by whom, exactly?). Left eye was the scarring one was just too mangled to fit in, so instead it's been replaced by a run-on sentence (d'oh) incorporating the general feel of someone relaxing as the alcohol sets in. Oh, and I've taken the 'mood' of the word Arctic (cold) rather than the colour (which is what exactly?).
(At this point, because it's come up, I'm going to point out the difference between a proper noun and everything else. In English (unlike, say, German) nouns, verbs and adjectives are spelt with a lower-case letter and refer to something generic. Colours, for example, do not get capital letters when used as generic adjectives, no matter how Spanish they are. Proper nouns, on the other hand, refer to something specific and get a capital letter; Dee, the Second World War, the Arctic, Operation: Write More Better. If I am talking about the slave pit known as the Golden Tether, I use capitals. If I am talking about a bunch of slaves tied up with golden tethers I use lowercase. Get it got it good.)
Anyway, the point of all this was hopefully to demonstrate that you can get a lot more out of your writing if you ditch the fancy words.
Rule #2: Active Voice, Passive Voice
This is a personal pet hate of mine, specifically because I'm 99% sure I know what people are trying to do with it and seeing so many kids fail so miserably just makes me squirm. It's an overuse (and abuse) of the passive voice.
I've lost a whole bunch of you, haven't I? You're all sitting there nodding at the screen going, "Yeah, yeah fuck I hate the passive voice too!" and you've got no freaking clue what it is. That's okay; no-one teaches grammar in school nowadays, so it's not your fault. Seriously. Insults aside, passive and active voice are two different ways of describing how something happens to an object. With the active voice, the subject does something to an object. With the passive voice, the object has something done to it by the subject. Consider the following:
| Quote: | | Loki lit the cigarette. |
That's a sentence using the active voice. Someone is doing something. The same thing could be re-written in a passive voice as:
| Quote: | | The cigarette was lit by Loki. |
The 'by Loki' bit (the subject) is optional in the passive voice, incidentally, but not the active. This is where we start running into our furc problems, but before I go into that, a few more words on the use of the passive voice. So when should you use an active voice and when should you use a passive voice? Good question; and there's no real answer. Some of you out there may have heard the old adage that gets tossed around discouraging against the use of the passive voice; forgeddaboutit! More memes spread by undereducated English teachers (they didn't get taught grammar either). It's true that the passive voice can cause ambiguity about who is doing what; that's the whole point. As a rule of thumb, if you want to emphasize the subject of a sentence (the doer), use the active voice. If you want to emphasize the object of a sentence (what is being done) -- or when the subject is unknown, implied elsewhere, or irrelevant -- then use the passive voice.
In furc, passive voice abuse generally manifests itself as a weird avoidance of pronouns (he, she, it, they), articles (the, a) and adpositions (to, for, on, of). It should be noted that this kind of writing isn't technically passive voice per se, but I'm lumping it in here because the thing that I'm 99% sure of is the fact that pronoun/article/adposition avoidance is a badly botched attempt to use the passive voice for literary effect. I'm going to bring out my three words again; it doesn't work. When done well (or even simply adequately), passive voice can add to the mood of a set of actions. I say this self-servingly, incidentally, because I do it all the time. Har ha!
Anyway, it's example time. Here is an original, random desc I've pulled from my logs. I didn't have to look far, incidentally, to find something:
| Quote: | | Handsome rogue: Lengthy blonde tresses cascaded to waist, flowing over pale flesh and open alabaster shirt revealing lean stomach, scar about chest; trousers and boots upon legs, cutlass at side. Occuli of a greenish hue would be the only noticible color on male's body besides jeweled rosary, crucifix, and many silver rings 'pon fingers. Pinkened lips curled up into a smirk, obviously proud of his latest plunder. |
Let's ignore the ubiquitous occuli and 'pon there for a moment (and incorrect use of a colon, but who's counting), and concentrate on the complete and utter lack of pronouns and articles. Ick. I wave my magic keyboard over this mess and we get:
| Quote: | | A handsome rogue. Lengthy blonde tresses cascaded down to a lean waist; flowing over pale flesh and a white cotton shirt open to expose a jagged scar. Trousers, boots and a wicked cutlass finished off the look. Brilliant green eyes shone in otherwise pale fur, accented by a jewelled rosary, crucifix and an abundance of silver rings. Rosy lips curled up into a smirk, obviously proud of his latest plunder. |
Hrm, still a few run-on sentences and awkward descriptions in there, but overall we're preserving the original 'style' (the passive voice description) without overtly raping the grammar of the reader. Notice we've done it not by knocking out articles (in fact, we need a lot more indefinite articles than we normally would) but by removing all but one pronoun. There's a kind of trick to this style of writing, and the rule of thumb is that if you're going to knock out a pronoun ('his eyes'), you might need to then pad out the sentence with an article ('the' if you want to sharply emphasise that particular noun, 'an/a' if not) and/or an adjective. So:
| Quote: | | Large ears bowed tall over skull, and mismatched eyes glanced side to side. |
Which sounds very awkward (not to mention 'bowed tall' makes no sense), becomes:
| Quote: | | Large ears loomed over a sleek skull, mismatched eyes glancing side to side. |
See how the 'over skull' part, which is grammatically jarring, becomes a lot smoother when an article and an adjective get thrown in the middle? Welcome to the English language.
Rule #3: Pacing
Okay, it's time for Grammar 101 again. Today we are going to ask; what is a sentence? To put it very, very simply; a sentence is some words in which something (a noun) does something (a verb). Loki leapt. is a fairly simple sentence. Sentences can get more complicated when we start adding in objects (Loki leapt through the window.), adjectives (Loki leapt through the broken window.) and adverbs (Loki made a running leap through the broken window.). They get more complicated still when we start tacking other phrases onto the end of them, forming compound and complex (or compound-complex) sentences; Loki made a running leap through the broken window, dodging the many grasping paws as he did so. The exact specifics of what is a compound sentences versus what is a complex sentence and so forth are a bit irrelevant here, but hopefully you get the gist.
Note that not all things that start with a capital and end with a full stop are sentences. Shit. That, for example, is not a sentence; it's an expletive sitting there all on its own, emphasising something. This gets important later.
There are a couple of things I want to address here. The first one is the dreaded run-on sentence. A run-on sentence is generally formed either when compound/complex sentences are missing their punctuation, or two or more independent sentences are strung together into one. Loki made a running leap through the window his fall on the other side broken only by shards of shattered glass. is a run-on sentence. We can fix this in a couple of ways; adding a semi-colon, (... the window; his fall...) or full stop. If this was a slightly more generic example, I could even use a comma and a conjunction ('and', 'but').
Like all punctuation, we can generally tell where one sentence ends and another one begins by reading it out loud and listening to where we put the 'breaks'. Most of us were never actively taught written grammar, but interestingly I've met very few people who speak with incorrect punctuation (a comma or semi-colon is a short breath or emphasis, a full stop is a more substantive break). If we read a run-on sentence out loud it sounds wrong; it sounds rushed, hurried. In fact, some authors use run-on sentences (especially in dialogue or first-person narration) deliberately for exactly this reason.
Welcome to the wonderful world of pacing.
Not all sentences are created equal. Some are short, some are long, some are complex, some are simple, and some aren't sentences at all. Listen to someone speak and you'll usually hear them use all of these. A bunch of long, complex-compound sentences sounds slow, deliberate, careful. A bunch of short sentences sounds fast, pointed, abrupt. A short sentence in the middle of a bunch of long ones adds a specific emphasis. A (deliberate) run-on sentence sounds panicked, messy, frightened. When we write, we need to learn how to pick the length of sentence that can properly convey the tone and mood of what we're trying to get across. Both previous major examples have used different length sentences to dramatic effect (A handsome rogue., Indeed.).
Anyway, enough natter; it's time for an example:
| Quote: | | This would be his first sigs to keep her hands to her self as he snarled around bared his fangs as he watched her hand but contuined with his questioning of her while easing back to sit firmly down on the pillow below him. "I am impressed in that care your name is? " |
Holy motherfucking McChrist someone needs to learn punctuation. What an absolutely incomprehensible mess (not to mention the passage was actually a lot longer but I cut it out for being unreadably inane)! I dunno about you, but I've got no freakin' clue what's going on here. Let's see if we can't fix that:
| Quote: | | The snarl was vicious -- fangs and all -- and a pointed reminded that she should keep her hands to herself. Still wary, he eased back into the pillow behind him; eyes never leaving her wandering hands. "I'm impressed." A brief pause, then, "And your name is?" |
Christ I never want to look at that passage again; hopefully you get the point. We're almost done, anyway, there's just one more thing...
Rule #4: Getting Tense
Ah, grammatical tenses! I already covered this a little back in Rule #1, but I think it's worth pointing out again because I see it so frequently. I see way too much future (both simple and perfect) tense lurking around in furc. There's also a lot of mixing of simple past (Loki laughed.), past perfect (Loki would laugh.) and simple present (Loki laughs.) tenses. This is a problem which is particular to roleplaying, since -- unlike fiction writing where the 'default' narration has already happened -- stuff that occurs in RP is kind of assumed to be happening right now. Because I'm a writer before I'm a roleplayer, I tend to RP in past tense, but present tense can also work... so long as it's kept consistent. It's example time:
| Quote: | | Laucian laughs. "Yea nightmares... Fuckign running around. My head is all rainbows and flippin' puppies." He'd sneer and take another drink. Where was the adorable cuddly little subby? Hidden far far and deep away. Astas had made him loath it. Very few would see him as such. Very few. Though, as Loki spoke up he'd cringe and grow red. Oh that was a low blow. " Everyone has to just unlead my entire PERSONAL LIFE don't they! It's just one of those fucking nights." He'd growl and slam his fists down onto the countertop. Bloody tears anew scimmed down his cheek. "Damn it..." He'd wipe them away as quickly as he could and run for it. To the gardens, where he could bleed his tears away from the watching eyes at the bar. |
Okay, to do this one I'm going to do two re-writes; one using present tense and one using past tense, just to highlight the difference. Here goes:
| Quote: | | Laucian laughs. "Yeah, nightmares... Fuckin' runnin' around. My head is all rainbows and flippin' puppies." He sneers and takes another drink. Where was the adorable, cuddly little subby? Hidden deep, deep down; Astas had made him loathe it and very few people nowadays would see him as such. Very few. Though as Loki speaks he cringes, heat rising in his cheeks. That had been a low blow. "Everyone always has to unearth my entire personal life, don't they?" He growls, slamming a fist down onto the countertop. "It's just one of those fuckin' nights. Damnit..." Bloody tears turn his vision a bleary crimson. He fights the urge to wipe them away, to run for it; out to the gardens where he can bleed his shame away from the prying eyes of the bar. |
Present tense is kinda difficult for narration since there's often a constant need to swap between using it for things that are happening now (As Loki speaks...), and past tense for the things that have happened previously (That had been a low blow.). With past tense narration, this distinction becomes easier to manage since you're talking about things that have happened in the past versus things that have happened in the more paster. Compare:
| Quote: | | Laucian laughed. "Yeah, nightmares... Fuckin' runnin' around. My head is all rainbows and flippin' puppies." He sneered and took another drink. Where was the adorable, cuddly little subby? Hidden deep, deep down; Astas had made him loathe it and very few people nowadays would see him as such. Very few. Though as Loki spoke he cringed, heat rising in his cheeks. That had been a low blow. "Everyone always has to unearth my entire personal life, don't they?" He growled, slamming a fist down onto the countertop. "It's just one of those fuckin' nights. Damnit..." Bloody tears turned his vision a bleary crimson. He fought the urge to wipe them away, to run for it; out to the gardens where he could bleed his shame away from the prying eyes of the bar. |
Like I said, personally I prefer past tense because I think it reads better and is easier to manage, but it's a personal preference thing. So long as whatever you're doing you're doing it consciously.
Incidentally, where do you use simple future tense? Anywhere you want to describe a predictive action or intention (When the time comes, Loki will run.). Future perfect is a bit more obtuse and is used to describe an action that has happened in a hypothetical future. Confusing? What about: In an ideal world, Loki will have gone. Compare this to the usual, incorrect, way people use these tenses in furc (As his friend begins to storm off, Loki would have just shrugged.) and hopefully you can start to see the difference. Future tense is a bit interesting since it's not used very often in third-person fiction narration; however we tend to use it all the time in first-person dialogue ("This afternoon I will go to the mall", "By tomorrow I will have gone to the mall."), which is I think where the confusion comes from.
And there you go; four simple rules that, if abided by, will hopefully eradicate 90% of the bad writing in Furcadia. Too easy. _________________ It's people like us that give people like us a bad name. |
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Itai TGT Forum Slave

Joined: 04 Oct 2005 Posts: 3406 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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Tenses are even more fun when you RP in past tense and your partner RPs in present tense. Especially when one or the other starts getting their tense mixed up because of reading the other's post. I think that accounts for a small percent of Furcadia's tense-hoppers, myself included. _________________ http://ridia.deviantart.com
Use the right word, not its second cousin. - Mark Twain
Chillin' after an awesome rampage of monster murder. |
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Alain Mascot

Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 578
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Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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I love you. _________________
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Xxys Forum General

Joined: 25 Aug 2006 Posts: 361 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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I can never come to understand a sidelined implicative post anyway, unless it's posed as a forebearer for a possible continuitive or future reprisal should the means and necessity occur. _________________ I never saw a wild thing
sorry for itself.
A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
without ever having felt sorry for itself. |
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Anafiel Forum General

Joined: 02 Dec 2006 Posts: 173
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Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:17 pm Post subject: |
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*whimpers* I'm not perfect grammatically, lord knows I'm not the best speller. I check all my posts in word before posting them to make sure they are spelled correctly and don't sound idiotic but I don't know if I follow all the rules you have put forth here. Guh! Now I'm going to go nuts making sure that I do XD
| Alis Dee wrote: | | Incidentally, where do you use simple future tense? |
About this bit - I often use this tense in combat, describing actions that might happen if they are not otherwise countered or avoided and the intended outcome of said actions.
"John aimed a kick for his midsection. If the blow landed, it might be hard enough to send Fred to the ground." _________________ Anafiel's desc --- Jessie's desc --- Eshlyn's desc |
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Alis Dee Patron

Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Australia
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Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:21 am Post subject: |
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Heh, I think the main point is just to always be conscious of what you're doing. Like, I use stupid words sometimes (I still cringe at the phrase "belie the countenance" which I have a habit of abusing) and have a tendency to occasionally switch tense (usually because I started writing in present and realise it's awkward) and make typos, but all the while I'm conscious as to what I should be writing. I honestly think simply being aware of what is 'good' written form goes miles and miles to making people better writers. I had a really hard time, for instance, looking for an example of bad punctuation/pacing; most people at least have their commas and their full stops in reasonably the right places, because people are aware that this makes their writing easier to read.
On the other hand, certain memes get spread around when it comes to using ridiculous words and the passive voice. I say memes because the only way I can imagine that they spread is memetically; one person sees another person (generally someone they perceive is popular or talented) using passive voice or a fancy word, then they copy it, then someone sees them and so forth until enough people are doing it that it becomes an ingrained norm. People aren't conscious of it as being somehow odd, and they also don't have enough exposure to grammar/good writing/writing theory/whatever to deconstruct what they're doing.
All so-called rules of creative writing are there to be broken and all that, but you need to at least be aware of the fact that there are rules (and why) in the first place. _________________ It's people like us that give people like us a bad name. |
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Zexnon TGT Forum Slave

Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 1507 Location: In mah belleh
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Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:30 am Post subject: |
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There is no such thing as a perfect roleplayer.
I am happy about that. _________________
Who was the first person to look at a cow and say, "I think I'll squeeze these dangly things here, and drink whatever the hell comes out!" |
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Faedriel Barfly

Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 59
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Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Loki lit the cigarette. |
That usually comes as a result of the furcadia text buffer's emote thing. You could add something onto it....
| Quote: | | Loki lit the cigarette as he turned towards the voice "...What?" |
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Alis Dee Patron

Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Australia
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 6:51 am Post subject: |
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| Zexnon wrote: | | There is no such thing as a perfect roleplayer. |
Ye-ee-ee-es, I suppose so. But there's no such thing as a perfect a lot of things, but that doesn't means we shouldn't stop trying to improve our skills. Like, there's no such thing as a perfect driver but would you seriously try and tell me that means we should completely disregard the road rules?
| Faedriel wrote: | | That usually comes as a result of the furcadia text buffer's emote thing. You could add something onto it.... |
Uh, the example had nothing to do with the furc buffer; it was a straight example of an active-voiced sentence. Adding stuff onto the end doesn't make it not active voice, it just makes it a more complicated sentence. _________________ It's people like us that give people like us a bad name. |
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Adawolf Forum General

Joined: 10 Aug 2006 Posts: 145 Location: Hanging upside down just over your head
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:59 am Post subject: |
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I like my flowery words thank you very much! And I like to use adatives(SP?). I write short stories often, with the use of spell check, and I think that replacing a few words or adding a few words really helps. Although I HATE the words 'Auds' and 'occulars'. _________________ "That woman is an angel and she stands witness to your crimes and she stands witness to your curse. I am the hand of righteousness!" he proclaimed, lifting up the scythe---then realizing he needed it to stand. Oops. "I am the---AACK!" And over he went, sprawling on the floor.~Qix |
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Faedriel Barfly

Joined: 12 Jul 2006 Posts: 59
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 11:26 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Uh, the example had nothing to do with the furc buffer; it was a straight example of an active-voiced sentence. Adding stuff onto the end doesn't make it not active voice, it just makes it a more complicated sentence. |
I most often see a sentence like that when someone is making an emote, hense my mentioning the furcadia buffer. |
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Alis Dee Patron

Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Australia
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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@Adawolf
I'm kinda curious as to where you got the impression that I was telling people not to use adjectives. There's nothing wrong with adjectives, or even descriptive sentences. What I am cautioning against is using archaic or obtuse words either just for the sake of it, or in the mistaken belief that it makes someone look like a better writer. The cruel fact is that it doesn't. I'm not just making this stuff up for the fun of it, either; the term 'purple prose' comes originally from Horace (Roman poet from the first century BCE), so writers have been thinking about it for at least two thousand years that we know of. I mean, feel free to think you're a better writer than Horace, but not even I'm that egotistical (and I doubt it was what you're implying).
So why is it really bad? Why does flowery prose instantly scream "INEXPERIENCED WRITER"?
Well, first off; if you look through the examples from other people I've given above I think almost all of them use words incorrectly or in an awkward context. English is very flexible; just because something is a synonym for something else in one context doesn't necessarily mean that it is in every context. If we look at Xxys' post above, we notice s/he uses a really, really odd word; sidelined. It's not archaic or overly formal like the rest of the sentence. It's a common word but the context is odd. If you go look it up in a thesaurus (like I did, and like I assume Xxys did since it's Google's first hit) you'll see that it can be used as a synonym for 'lame'. Ah, makes more sense now! So, instead of sidelined implicative post we can read this as lame implicative post. ('Implicative', incidentally, means "to express indirectly" and is the adjectival form of 'imply'.) But wait a sec, 'sidelined' is also technically a synonym for 'dormant'. Dormant implicative post doesn't really make a lot of sense. Neither does abandoned implicative post. How about going backwards from 'lame' again? Handicapped post? Sore post? Hamstrung post? Remember that while we use 'lame' colloquially as a generic pejorative term (ie. we use it to describe things we think are stupid), originally if something was lame it meant it had some kind of difficulty walking. If I broke my leg, I'd be lame; in both contexts, some would say.
The point is that just because you see something in a thesaurus doesn't mean that it works directly as a replacement word. Unnecessary 'thesaurus humping' by people who don't really understand the contexts and meanings of the words they're using is awfully jarring to anyone who does.
The other part of this, which is also evident in the examples in my original post (and yours, in fact) is that when people use unfamiliar words they're much more likely to fall victim to 'near-enough-is-good-enough'. It's not just a case of bad spelling. I'm an atrocious speller (thank you, Firefox spell check), but I know that 'additive' and 'adjective' are two different words. The same with 'diluted' and 'dilated'.
With English, like everything else, you really need to learn to walk before you can run. I used to play the trumpet, and anyone who's played the trumpet will tell you that middle C, G and C5 in a basic scale have the same key-combination (no keys depressed); but they're certainly not the same note. If I decided that they were, and played a middle C every time that the music called for an C5, I'd be chucked out of band. Similarly, if I decided that a C# was close enough to a C, and that I'd play that every time instead I'd meet a similar fate. The difference between C4, G and C5 is all in the embouchure, and I had to spend a lot of time learning to be able to play the difference before I could move off scales and onto the national anthem. It's the same with writing; I need to learn the blues and the opens before I can move onto my azures and my dilations.
For those of you who are saying, "This chick's an idiot! I totally know what blue means!" Well. If you can't pick the mistakes out of the example posts I've given (and you can be honest, no-one's watching)... sorry, you really don't. That's okay, though; you've got plenty of time to learn and you're a lot further ahead than all those people who are refusing to admit there's anything wrong at all.
Finally, the other other reason purple prose is bad is because it's really fucking distracting to what you're writing. If I'm paying more attention to a dictionary than to your writing, you've got a problem.
But by all means don't just take my word for it. Instead, how about the words of the 2006 winner of the annual Bulwer-Litton Fiction Contest, Jim Guigli:
| Quote: | | Detective Bart Lasiter was in his office studying the light from his one small window falling on his super burrito when the door swung open to reveal a woman whose body said you've had your last burrito for a while, whose face said angels did exist, and whose eyes said she could make you dig your own grave and lick the shovel clean. |
Truly the stuff of nightmares. _________________ It's people like us that give people like us a bad name. |
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Zexnon TGT Forum Slave

Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 1507 Location: In mah belleh
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Alis Dee wrote: | | Zexnon wrote: | | There is no such thing as a perfect roleplayer. |
Ye-ee-ee-es, I suppose so. But there's no such thing as a perfect a lot of things, but that doesn't means we shouldn't stop trying to improve our skills. Like, there's no such thing as a perfect driver but would you seriously try and tell me that means we should completely disregard the road rules |
Road rules are set in place for a reason...so people don't crash and kill other people =) Roleplay rules aren't avoiding fatalities...and I've always found rules in roleplay rather redundant. It's like Talz's goddamn page on good roleplaying or what the fuck ever.
Let me explain further because I tend to /do/ that sometimes.
I've seen it before, a hundred times over. Page after page of people posting rules for proper roleplay, for GOOD roleplay. Now you see this is pointless because you are beating a dead horse. No one has to listen to you or follow your rules, so why push it to the limit? Let me basically break down every rule you just made into simple terms. We'll start with the blue balls rule, number one to be precise. Oh sorry, it was purple prose. Mixed that up for a second there.
Number one: Purple Pubes
A lot of people on Furcadia do like the olde time writing, that is their /style/. Sure at times it is overrated and annoying, however it's been bitched about ENDLESSLY. Just because a few dozen people whine about how they type obviously doesn't mean it will end anytime soon. Afterall it's continued for many years and shall continue for many years to come. The conclusion? Leave the fuckers alone and let them 'pon, 'neath, and tress it up until their fingers fall off. It's their choice afterall. But moving along...
Number two: Active Loins, Passive STD
What I love about this section is how you put so much strain on active and passive in a roleplaying game mostly run by teenagers. Seriously...did you steal pages from the grammar nazi's dictionary and paste it into this thread? It's almost disgusting. The arrogance is simply oozing from this particular piece, making me want to vomit a little. So tell me...what was it that made you so damn picky about someone else's skills? Did you have nightmares as a child of semi-colons and question marks chasing you through dark alley ways? I bet they had super lazer guns and bullwhips as well too?
I suppose I just think it's stupid to constantly point out someone's flaws. If they want to fix it, they will. And yes, grammar is still taught in schools. Quite frequently as far as I know. People choose to either absorb it or ignore it, but that is their own doing. I don't admit to be perfect. But the point is, people can still UNDERSTAND ME. Roleplay is not about how perfect or pretty you can make your /writing/ look...it's about the storylines and stretching your imagination. It's not cool to bully =(
Number three: More things to be picky about
Thanks for the grammar lesson. I hope we don't have a pop quiz tomorrow. Afterall, I have to go leap through windows most of the day.
I think I am almost done here. How about I wrap up my conclusion on this note.
There is no need to be picky. I could see you as an editor in the near future, if not already. Make a career out of your picky nature, I am sure you'd make millions.
However, obsessing over poor grammar and punctuation on a text based game is a BIG waste of time. It's Furcadia for crying out loud...we aren't writers for the goddamn New York Times or anything. It's roleplay, and I know when I RP I don't think about perfection. I think about fun. I do like RPing with people who have decent spelling and typing skills. However I don't sit around and whisper every person who 'sucks' with my two cents on how to fix it. Typically, time fixes all.
I think finger waving is just...not worth it. I found most of this thread to be rather disgusting and rude. You can keep sitting pretty on your pedistool but I know I wouldn't RP with someone who I thought was judging everything I did on how I write. I am not the best but damnit I do a decent enough job. Afterall, I've kept plenty of interest from others over the years.
In the end just lay off...you certainly aren't going to fix this 'huge' Furcadia related problem and the diversity is nice. Just let it be hmmm?
Now I'm rambling. But y'all get my point.
-Z _________________
Who was the first person to look at a cow and say, "I think I'll squeeze these dangly things here, and drink whatever the hell comes out!" |
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Alis Dee Patron

Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 13 Location: Australia
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, um okay. Usually I'd reply to such a long-worded post but there's so much vitriol and ad hominem here that I just don't really know what to say. You seem to be fairly personally aggrieved which is a little sad; I really wasn't trying to attack anyone directly. I like good writing, being a teenager does not make you stupid or incapable of good writing, grammar really isn't taught adequately in schools any more (I certainly wasn't taught it -- the first time I'd heard of a 'dangling participle' was playing King's Quest -- and it's a major public debate in my country) and I'm talking about writing form not roleplay plots. I agree; you don't have to be a good writer to be a good storyteller, but it's much easier to get other people interested in your tales if you can express them clearly.
I also know that I write like an arrogant, egotistical fucknut; I say it outright a couple of times (and make fun of it at least once) and, well, it's a deliberate style choice believe it or not. People generally either love this 'persona' or hate it, which is the point; it gets people's attention. It certainly got yours. It's effective writing; even if you don't agree with me, you're still thinking about what I've said.
Roleplay is a kind of collaborate storytelling told through writing, and writing is an art. Like it or not, all artistic endeavours have 'rules'; be it my example about the notes on my trumpet or the use of perspective and colour in art. Most masters of avant-garde arts (be they the early Impressionists or the Beatles or whomever) will likely admit that in order to successfully break the rules, you need to know they exist (and why) in the first place. Even the Sex Pistols -- and despite urban myth to the contrary -- knew how to play their instruments. I'm not saying no-one should ever experiment with language or all write in the equivalent of a Stephen Hawking robot voice (good writer, incidentally); of course I'm not. You don't have to write like anything. I can't make you, and I don't really have any interest in doing so.
However -- and as strange as this may seem -- I really, really honest-to-gods do just love writing as an art. In case you couldn't tell by how goddamn loquacious I am (before I was Alis I was Loqia, which came from Loquacia) I enjoy producing prose in the same way other people -- including myself, incidentally -- love drawing or coding or playing video games. I also love reading eloquent prose; I read books not just to get through a story, but to study the written form and the literary techniques used by the authors.
It strikes me a bit odd that places like deviantART are absolutely littered with tutorials on How to Draw/Colour/Ink/Make Cool Light Effects/Port, yet those artists don't get attacked or accused of 'beating dead horses' or 'pointing out flaws'. Less talented artists are constantly doing fanart for more advanced artists and no-one that I know of panics about the latter 'judging' the gifts given to them by the former.
Maybe it would help to think of what I'm saying in that context; as a kind of tutorial. You don't have to take it as gospel, just like I don't have to use a consistent lighting source in my art despite every single colouring tutorial ever made telling me it's a good idea. (It really does make your art look more professional though.)
If just one person walks away after reading this and suddenly finds themselves thinking a little more about the art behind their writing, then I haven't been wasting my time. Believe it or not, since putting this up I've had a few people deliberately track me down and try and engage me in roleplay just so they can get a 'critique' of their style (um, it's very flattering and all but not just a little bit uncomfortable!); the interesting part is that everyone who's done this has actually been a better than average writer to begin with. I guess anyone who cares enough to track down criticism of their work (even from a posturing hack like yours truly) is obviously constantly looking for ways to improve; and it shows. The truth is, everyone is always subconsciously judging everyone else's writing/rp; the only difference here is that I've had the audacity to put it into words. How dare I! I must be such an ogre!
... and yet, I've tried very hard not to publicly insult anyone. Sure, I've taken other people's words but I've done my damnedest to de-identify them (I went over each passage several times to make sure I hadn't left anything too incriminating in). My own writing is freely available if people want to read it. If people want to self-servingly rope me into RP just to see how I play, they can do that too (and I'm fairly certain some people already have; incidentally, I think I'm a pretty good writer but a bit of a mediocre roleplayer). I'm not hiding anything, I just like talking about writing.
If that offends anyone, tough.
(There we go, I started out a bit shaky but I knew I'd get the words in by the end!) _________________ It's people like us that give people like us a bad name. |
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Xxys Forum General

Joined: 25 Aug 2006 Posts: 361 Location: Australia
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Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Adawolf wrote: | | Although I HATE the words 'occulars'. |
Anyone using the nonexistant word, occulars, needs to start getting a sincere grasp of opthomology and the anatomy of the eye, rather than relying on assumption and word guessing.
But I digress, and will add a second two cents:
The only rule that I can see which entirely remains relevant to roleplay or authoring of any kind is this:
Don't butcher the language you wish to author in, or literate people will dislike your incapability of respecting and annotating the language you were informally, or formally trained in.
A prime example, albeit not English, are all the Japanophiles out there walking about shouting one or several word miniscule vocabularies and expecting to be seen as some fluent Japanese speaking individual.
Baka this. Baka that.
Chibi this. Chibi that.
Kawaii this. Kawaii that.
Anime this. Anime that.
I don't care if people attempt to learn Japanese by watching subtitled cartoons. It's not formal education, and thus not truly learning, comprehending and understand a language. It's solely guess work through the piecing together of words that, although subtitled and translated, may not be precisely the format of which to express and speak said language.
Learn to express, format and interpret a language. Not chew it up, vomit it out onto a filthy floor, eat said vomit and then shit all over the country from which the language originated.
Same can be said for all the wannabe Shakespeares out there butchering old English. _________________ I never saw a wild thing
sorry for itself.
A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
without ever having felt sorry for itself. |
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